She knew Don had been harassing her, too. And from the beginning, Tana understood that her attractiveness to Don meant she'd be seen rather than ignored. And I remember that so specifically, because it was like, my rent. Tana did tell her parents, though it took her a while. That's when Kristen said she felt like she had an understanding to share. I mean, there was something about it that was just very profoundly disturbing. Starlee Kine gets answers about her parents marriage from her dad...after a lifetime of mystery. I know why he wants me here. Not Don, Jan. Jan was, at various points, Don's second-in-command. Yeah. Some he said were mischaracterized. And I was like, I don't think so. Tana had just started college, but it was summer, so she spent most of her days at the shop. He ran a shop in town. And I'm like, OK, so I'd send him the work email. I mean, I definitely didn't say, hey, you know what I'd love to see right now? You should use them. And I just remember being like, feeling really weird that she said that to me, because it sounded so serious. The boys lacrosse team needs them. A coworker said he found Jeff in the shop one morning, waking up surrounded by beer bottles. It was black and white. Kristen started talking. This is the way boys are. It's like, they were fine. Then I could step in. And I didn't know how to respond. He made Tana uncomfortable, but he was so pitiful that it felt unreasonable to attach any value to her discomfort. After Don's story came Congressman Patrick Meehan, Michael Douglas, Rob Porter and the sentencing of Larry Nassar. I apologize to anyone I offended and treated badly. (16 1/2 minutes). Don wanted to be generous, to be a wealthy, charming man who could give her beautiful things. Yeah. It was Onnesha's colleague, Laura, who noticed it first. Producer Chana Joffe-Walt fills in for Ira Glass this week. It gave her more power professionally to have the attention of the most powerful person in the office, even if it meant accepting the attention that was not professional, like when Don kept telling her he wanted to buy her a black cocktail dress he thought would look great on her body. It's not a story about him, it's about them, these five women. This guy comes up to me, and he's got a reporter's pad, and he said, hey, after he's done talking, you know, can I talk to you? (9 minutes). This is what it meant to be close to someone. LaDonna sets out to understand how this place is run. But that's how full of rage I was by that point. Sometimes it would be, like, compliments and praise; other times it would just-- he would be, like, furious about the pettiest thing. I was too affected by the idea that he was giving you a chance. Deanna and Kristen went out for drinks. It was irritating, but Tana tried really hard not to show it because Jeff was middle-aged, miserable, she'd heard his wife kicked him out. He thought I needed for him to buy me this dress, when I could have just bought it myself. (14 1/2 minutes), Kristen has no trouble naming what’s going on with Don: sexual harassment. And he was like, you knew. I'm going to force you to reckon with it by making you the object of my sexual desire. Like, he's an idiot. When Kristen walked in, Don was already there. And I was just like, ew, and just got up and went outside and smoked a cigarette, and told all the people at the conference, can you believe that this dinosaur man just said that to me? He asked about her. I think he'd sort of laugh it off, and say, oh, you just don't get it. Men also seemed to want her, but had no thoughts about what else that might look like. And I think a lot of the shameless way he would look at or talk about my body was a way for him to kind of force me to see him as a sexual being. --slept with it at night, and I actually-- and I'm eight. And I was like, sure, you know, what are you writing for, or whatever. They weren't co-creators. He kept insisting, I am the most feminist man you know, and you know it. And I was just started, like, I actually got dizzy. If you don't want to hear that, maybe you're listening with kids, you can get a beeped version at our website, ThisAmericanLife.org. She said nothing. She did have one idea of someone who could help, a woman Lauren actually had just met at a book party, a woman in her 30s who had worked with Don in the past. And I think maybe after that, I was just ready. It was the opposite. The first time it was Face from the A-Team. But that's how I felt. She didn't know anything about the woman sitting in that chair next to Don, but Onnesha had always known she did not want to be in that chair. And special thanks to Heidi Baker and Heidi Schreck, who wrote an episode of the TV show I Love Dick that inspired today's show. The next day, Don sent her his article, very pro-Dean, and a personal note to her. And he says, you know, these are photos from my past. This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange. It felt bad. Why would she need to do that? He wasn't offering to pay her rent directly, just did she need a salary increase to help pay her rent, which Onnesha did not want to talk about. OK. You're having a good time. Don seemed to think it was appropriate to show her that picture. So she’s surprised when she meets a man who’s different — Don. He did not seem to love her personality. I was like, I came very close to maybe killing this person. It's like survival of the fittest, like, I can handle the bullying and the sexual harassment. Jan does remember Kristen telling him about this, but does not recall responding in this way. They are dumb. And I was like, you've got to be fucking kidding me. I'll support you. This American Life. And I was like, I can't even imagine what the look on my face must've been like. He'd look after her career, and he'd flirt with her while he was doing it. Or something like that. She called his friends, his friends' friends, and found Mark an IT job, which he hated, so she found him another job at a magazine, and he worked there for the next 10 years. But suddenly, I had to reckon with the fact that I did not look the same to other people. Yeah. Who were they when they entered the workplace, and how did their personal histories shape the way they dealt with his harassment? A couple months in, the whole AlterNet staff got together for some meetings. The Interview went well, which felt great to Tana, because she was used to bombing interviews. He ran AlterNet, a progressive news website, and he was a flirt. I could engage her in conversation, whatever, right. He was 12, so was she. And then I'm sitting in the back of the room, on the couch with this other woman, Lynn, and she looks up and she goes, hm, the cupcakes. Deanna tried to make sense of this behavior. Deanna helped connect Kristen with a lawyer. He offered her a ride. All those times when we were mad at those boys because of what they did to us. It's so hard to integrate. This was his story. We were, like, joking about it. He headed out, and wrote Deanna, asking her to join him. In hindsight, I want to slap my dumb 25-year-old self. Today's show was produced by Susan Burton and Robyn Semien. I regret causing harm, and I'm reckoning with it. Lauren asked to talk to Deanna, Deanna remembers. I definitely didn't enjoy the experience. So he starts screaming at me, like, the eyes bulging, the red--, He's screaming, I am the most feminist man--. She was in the back room where the staff took breaks and wrote notes. But it still didn't make sense. They tell us not only about their troubling encounters with him, but also about their lives beforehand. Like, I'm not a 60-something-year-old man with no sexuality. What else did she want to do? Deanna wanted more time with Don, more contact, as he did with her. Dear Kristen, you have nice boobs. There was no office in New York, so it was easy to pretend this was appropriate. And I remember, like, taking a deep breath and saying--. As Harvey Weinstein goes to trial, we have a different kind of #MeToo story about several women who worked for the same man. She said no, I'll take the train. And eventually she did explain. She’s the first Alternet employee angry enough to try to do something about it. Don told her to send him her article, and if it was good, he'd publish it. I guess you don't care about me. You're strong and smart and independent, and that just is never going to make sense to men. He liked that I was young, and he thought I was, like, cool. Aunt Rose explained it would be Deanna's job to make sense of things to men. Deanna volunteered for the Howard Dean campaign. This was sex to end a fight. Wait, but had you-- what would have happened had you said, yeah, I am having trouble paying my rent. (8 minutes), Tana is clear on how to deal with Don. She'd written him letters, dedicated a song to him on the radio, and nothing, no response. Instead, she entered into an unspoken agreement between a cool girl and a flirty boss. Managing a relationship was a role Deanna had practice in. He would say, why did you email me about personal stuff, and there's no work info in here? Tana engaged, Onnesha did not. Maybe it's kind of petty, but I was like, you are not going to win. That's the saddest thing. And he seemed very, like, grateful, and I had not had that experience before. Because I really didn't want to challenge him. But I mean, it's not normal. You can't even talk. He had an apartment for her to crash in, he had contacts she should meet, he bought her first Mac laptop, he helped her quit smoking, dinner was on him, and he did it all without demanding she be a wife. That, she decided, was what mattered. And she was like, who are you you? A few years after they broke up, Deanna went to a protest uptown. And that's fucked up. She finds herself thinking about an old memory, and reconsidering things she’d come to think of as normal. I just sat there the whole time, like I didn't know. He'd had it for a long time, hadn't had symptoms in years. And she sent this hilarious email to all of editorial that was something to the effect of, whoever decided to print out porn in the office, please abstain from--. Deanna hadn't been with Don for years at this point.

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